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    Notrium modding questions/answers

    Quanrian 19 years ago
    It only looks like a 45 degree angle. If you watch the trajectory carefully you'll notice it glides on a different angle. Also you're not using angles, because they're evil You're using radians instead I believe.
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    ZeXLR8er 19 years ago
    "Quanrian" said:
    It only looks like a 45 degree angle. If you watch the trajectory carefully you'll notice it glides on a different angle. Also you're not using angles, because they're evil You're using radians instead I believe.
    Guh, yes, read the Modding FAQ.
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    Casanova 19 years ago
    I did use radians when needed, but in-game the creatures are always pushed at what appears like 45 degree angles relative to the screen.
    For example, if set to be pushed towards the enemy, it will miss it most of the time.
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    Quanrian 19 years ago
    "Casanova" said:
    I did use radians when needed, but in-game the creatures are always pushed at what appears like 45 degree angles relative to the screen.
    For example, if set to be pushed towards the enemy, it will miss it most of the time.

    This may actually have more to do with the collision detection for creatures than the effect itself. The effect may simply make a minor problem more obvious. You see collision for creatures is done with a small sphere, so there is a higher likelihood of trajectories missing the creature's hit detection because it glides right past the circumference of it's range.

    Slower moving bullets may help relieve the collision detection to some degree. Collision detection on a whole is imperfect at best. I know this doesn't solve your problem, but hopefully it helps explain it better so you can 'work around' it. Like many things people think up for modding they wont be able to do it the way 'they want', but that rarely means it can't be done. Try many different things, usually what works wont be as convenient and be more time consuming, but hey you're wanting it to work right, not just be convenient and quick
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    ville 19 years ago
    "Casanova" said:
    I just noticed that effect 67 pushes a creature at fixed 45 degree angle increments, was this intentional?

    Testing it, it indeed does do that. The reason is that the push speed of the creature is capped, and it is capped wrong. You can fix it for yourself by using a smaller value for parameter1, I'll fix the capping in the game.
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    Casanova 19 years ago
    Right now i was using 1 as the value for parameter 1. The problem with using something smaller is that it doesnt push it far enough.
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    Quanrian 19 years ago
    "Casanova" said:
    Right now i was using 1 as the value for parameter 1. The problem with using something smaller is that it doesnt push it far enough.

    This has to do with the creature's weight. If you want it to push a creature further it must weigh less. If you notice in the default game small blue aliens get shoved much further, this is due to their weight being lower even though the force they are shoved is the same. However if the caps are changed this shouldn't be as much of an issue, but you'll still need to take the creature's weight into account.
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    Casanova 19 years ago
    The bad thing is that i dont want to make the player or other creatures too light, or they will get thrown too far by other factors.

    Another problem is that a creature's walk animation will not change if the creature has a minimun walking speed equal to its max and there are no enemies nearby.
    Could there be a way to get around this? I need it to make grenades that spin and disks that rotate while in the air. Its not important but it would look nice.
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    ville 19 years ago
    Sounds more like a bug to me. I don't think there's a way around this other than fixing it in code.
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    ForceUser 19 years ago
    just a little question, is it possible to create "mission packs" for notrium (or any mod for that matter). I'm not talking about a mod per say, just a small wordpad file that you can dump in a folder and you would have an extra mission? Take Zex's mod for example. If he starts making missions but want's to ad missions later on but without other people having to dl the whole 5 or 10 mb file?

    Is it possible or will there have to some heavy modifications made to notrium itself?

    ForceUser
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    Doogsy 19 years ago
    The thing that takes up the most space in a mod is the graphics, so you could just make an update of the altered .dat files, and it would be very small, but if your talking about a new 'missions' file, then I don't think it could be done.
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    Grim Reaper 19 years ago
    I suggest making a new .dat file for Notrium to use, and there the missions would be listed, and possible additions would be in other .dat files.

    An exsample:
    0;//Mission number -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Tha Mission;//Mission name
    mission1creatures.dat;//Holds the information for those creatures of used in this mission and aren't already in the main creatures.dat
    mission1weapons.dat;//Same as above, except for weapons
    mission1(insert datafile name).dat;//Same as abouve except for (insert something here)

    It would be great, if that would be possible AND the game would treat the mission .dat files as extensions to the original ones.

    So, waddaya think?
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    Casanova 19 years ago
    I like this missions idea, but it would be better to keep the new dats on a separate folder inside the main mod folder. The item/po/creature numbers in the misson .dats would need to be different from the main mod to avoid overwriting the default ones.
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    ForceUser 19 years ago
    hmmm.. an installer program could be used to make the seperate folders easily enough. This way, anybody can add a "mod" to a mod

    ForceUser
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    Doogsy 19 years ago
    I'm not too big on the idea of more .dat files. In practice, you would only need a missions.dat. Why on earth would you need to create a sepereate creatures, weapons etc .dat when you would just use the main one. I could see the missions file working, but the type of mods that are being created are so varied that it would be very hard to accommodate everyones needs. Plus everything that would be able to be made mission wise can already be done using the .dat's we already have.
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    Grim Reaper 19 years ago
    Come to think of it, it would be better to have just one more .dat file, missions.dat, wich would contain any creatures, dialogs, weapons etc. that aren't included in the main .dat files, and if they are, then just make some kind of calling effect to the .dat file that holds the (insert something here). And still, the possible aditions included in the missions.dat would be continueing the list from the othre .dat files.

    Argh... Idea overload...
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    Quanrian 19 years ago
    Seriously there are over 20 files for new modders to figure out. You really want even more files, especially something as frivelous as what I'm hearing. Files that were added were to open up modding to hard coded aspects. This sounds like a way to make Notrium a bit more module based, but I'm not sold on the idea of it being worth it rather than just working with what is there now. Not to mention Ville has quite a few bugs to work on before he considers adding a whole new file
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    Grim Reaper 19 years ago
    But maby it could be in Notrium 2.0 or Notrium 2?
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    Doogsy 19 years ago
    It just seems pointless to me, adding a whole new file to do something that can already be done. Think of the amount of different type of missions that the file would need to account for. You've got the marine type missions (squadrons, kill enemies in area, return item etc), space type missions (escort, convey, bounty hunt, mining etc) Then theres other mods like forsaken (build this item to advance) The list of mod types goes on, and hence does the list of possible mission types. People would be forever asking to 'add this mission type for me' etc Just like people ask for more effects, only in this case it would be a barrage of askings. Its easy enough to make a mission using the original dat files rather than complicating Ville's work. Thats how I feel anyway. I just want to see a stable version with the effects and conditions working 100% before a whole set of new things come in
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    ForceUser 19 years ago
    hehe, ok, it was just a thought

    It's just that I'm shure there are guys out there that don't want to dl the whole 5 or 10 mb file each time it goes up a 0.1v.

    But I guess if the modder wants to do a tiny bit of extra work he can release seperate patches for his mod, zip files with only the new graphics and dat files. That should keep the size down

    ForceUser
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    Doogsy 19 years ago
    It should be the modders responsibility. If they want people to play their mod, they should release a patch for those people who don't have broadband, rather than just not caring.
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    MageKing17 19 years ago
    Is there a way to check if a player is not carrying an item, the opposite of condition 0?
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    ville 19 years ago
    No, not at the moment. I'm going to add it to the next version, you will be able to put 0 as the amount of items you're looking for.


    About the missions idea, I agree with ForceUser's latest post. If modders want to release smaller patches of their mods, they are welcome to do so. No need for a separate missions.dat file, especially considering it would not be possible to add such a file in the game.
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    Quanrian 19 years ago
    "MageKing17" said:
    Is there a way to check if a player is not carrying an item, the opposite of condition 0?

    While you can't use that condition you can use a bar instead. There is a bar type that specifically does nothing but keep track of the amount of an item's amount. So you simply set that bar up as invisible and check if it's less than 1. That should work just fine.
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    MageKing17 19 years ago
    "Quanrian" said:
    "MageKing17" said:
    Is there a way to check if a player is not carrying an item, the opposite of condition 0?

    While you can't use that condition you can use a bar instead. There is a bar type that specifically does nothing but keep track of the amount of an item's amount. So you simply set that bar up as invisible and check if it's less than 1. That should work just fine.
    That's seems like a rather roundabout way of doing it. I'd rather just add an item to the player's inventory at the beginning of the game and remove it once they get the other item.

    But no, that wouldn't work...
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    Quanrian 19 years ago
    This is a temporary solution until the update. You could always just wait, but it could be weeks till Ville releases another update However if you must do it now, the method I provided should work and it's not hard at all to setup either. However it wont work very well if you're going to check a ton of items. For just one item it should just fine and as I said, wont be difficult at all to setup. Chances are this will be one of the easiest things you'll ever setup for your mod
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    Casanova 19 years ago
    On the items.dat, how do i get my 'event failure text' to display on un-met conditions? Its just being ignored and replace with the default 'a [some item] required to work''. Some conditions do show the text i set.
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    Quanrian 19 years ago
    "Casanova" said:
    On the items.dat, how do i get my 'event failure text' to display on un-met conditions? Its just being ignored and replace with the default 'a [some item] required to work''. Some conditions do show the text i set.

    It should show it if ANY of the condition you provided weren't met. However it's just a single statement, not and individual one based on a specific condition. If you want it to say something specifically based on a condition you need to make sure this line...

    1;//show help text for conditions


    ...is shown.

    What that line does is show why they failed to use the item, but it goes down the list, so it's only going to show the reason why the first one to fail was unsuccessful. Sounds a bit confusing but you'll see what I mean when you fiddle with it a bit.

    If you ONLY want your failure text showing, make sure to set the above code to 0. That should keep it from overriding your failure text. Personally speaking I don't like using the show help for text which is why I asked Ville to add that above code a long time ago. So now we at least have a choice to use that feature of the engine or not. I wasn't aware however of it being able to override failure text, that isn't supposed to happen as far as I'm aware.
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    Doogsy 19 years ago
    I also noticed that the event failure text shows if there is something wrong with your effects. I was trying to change a value of a bar which the player didn't have, and this caused the event failure text to show, rather than the help for conditions text
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    Casanova 19 years ago
    If you ONLY want your failure text showing, make sure to set the above code to 0. That should keep it from overriding your failure text. Personally speaking I don't like using the show help for text which is why I asked Ville to add that above code a long time ago. So now we at least have a choice to use that feature of the engine or not. I wasn't aware however of it being able to override failure text, that isn't supposed to happen as far as I'm aware
    .

    If I set it to 0, then neither event failure text is displayed.

    Also if condition 16 is used and the player does not have the free weight, it will display "You need at leastt free weight". But this is probably a bug.
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    ville 19 years ago
    The failure text should be shown whenever the conditions of the item usage fail. Can you show me an example where it fails to work?
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    Casanova 19 years ago
    The default text overrides the custom text on almost all ocasions. Right now I can only remember condition 6 showing the event failure I set.
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    eug1404 19 years ago
    "Casanova" said:
    The default text overrides the custom text on almost all ocasions. Right now I can only remember condition 6 showing the event failure I set.
    That's helpfull to know.
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    Doogsy 19 years ago
    like I said, I found the event failure text only shows when an effect fails, not a condition. (as in trying to change a bar value when the player doesn't have the bar)
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    ZeXLR8er 19 years ago
    Yes, Doogsy's right, I've found that it always works when an effect fails, but the defualt text shows when a condition fails. Is this how its supposed to work, Ville?
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